why i am not afraid to take your money, by amanda fucking palmer

ummmm ive always thought that the webcasts for money thing was cute and fun, my only complaint was that im in the hole myself and i could never help you, your music has done so much for your fans, that i think it only appropriate to ask for help with your life, so what if its not “tasteful” if it was hoity toity and shit it wouldnt be AFP! people need to loosen the FUCK up and learn that people do things in different ways and those ways work too.

Amen!
Keep sticking up for yourself!
Much love to all,
~Sarah

Amen, indeed. I have two artist kids, and money for art is a perfectly appropriate energy exchange. In the world of folk/Americana/roots music that I was volunteering in, we had the same issues about how much to charge for house concerts and such. But this is the wave of the future, small-scale venues in the real world, and virtual performances like yours. Audiences need to appreciate the sacrifices the artists make to be accessible, up-close and personal. It’s an experience I’m willing to pay for. You’re doin’ great, Ms. Palmer.

I would rather buy something from you than going to the store and buying it. That’s why if a new cd/shirt/bracelet comes out I would rather buy it from them when I go to see them play than to go to a store and buy it. I feel if you buy it directly from the artist then you know where the money is going opposed if you buy if from a store. Plus if you didn’t do your lovely webcasts people wouldn’t have had the opportunity to buy the pregnancy test from Oasis (pee optional). So I say keep doing it.

Amen! I’ll happily throw a dollar in the tip jar anytime you play the LA area.

fucking AMEN! <3

Fuckin’ amen. I love you and what you do and will happily throw money at you to keep you doing the things I love whenever I have the chance. You are an inspiration, Amanda, and I wouldn’t give that up for anything. Thank you, sincerely, for what you do. <3

Amen.

Yes. Amen, Amanda! I admire your balls, your creativity, and your vision. Art IS worth money. And artists deserve to be rewarded for thier work. You are paving the way for a music world that is about the music – and it takes money. You inspire me as an artist and I continually look to you as an example of someone who refuses to sell out and will always stick to their values as an artist – never afraid to shake things up, piss people off, and god forbid, GET PAID. I applaud you and pretty much think you kick fucking ass.

amen, indeed.

why people are so willing to give their money to hot topic for a t shirt, then so bitchy about artists charging for things directly is beyond me. i commend you for your honesty on the subject, as i always expect from you.

Let’s see, I spent 20 bucks on the ticket to your VA show, about 60 in gas, another 60 for a hotel, and I’m sure I’ll still spend crazy ridiculous money on merchandise at the show. It’s all about the love and the fact that you’re putting yourself out there for us. It’s a JOB, except you’re doing what you love. We all have bills that need paid, and we all have different ways of doing so. Keep on bringing it. You’re doing fucking awesome.

A fucking Amen.

Don’t let dissenters get you down. I really believe that you are at the front of a wave of new thinking and new knowledge about how performing artists connect with their audience. I don’t think there’s any reason to fear that people will stop valuing for human contact. The fact that we are worried about stands as testimony to the fact that we don’t have to worry about it. Also, as someone who wishes she had the guts to busk by herself, thanks and you’re awesome.

I dont understand why people would find such an issue with this. Would this still be an issue if you did this IRL as opposed to over a web cam? What’s the difference? If anything you are more accessible to the fans who can watch/partake in the event who otherwise might not…..

Preaching to the choir I know….Keep rocking AFP! You are my hero.

amen. amen. amen. i go to your shows, listen to your cd’s and watch your webcasts (when i can) and i’m thrilled to see you receive pay for your work. funny that anyone would feel anything other than RAH! when they hear you raised 10k. you deserve it, Amanda Palmer. you freakin’ work hard and you’re talented. i’m always taken aback by how artists are expected to create for free. nobody else works for free. and your approach is fine. you own it. you don’t pretend to be doing anything else. here it is. you can’t do better than that.

cheers

Amen, for sure! I love that we’ve gone forward by going backward – that we now exchange value for value, that we support the people who support our hearts and our brains directly, from our hands to theirs. I love the honesty of it, and I love the honesty of you.

i really get where you’re coming from and i’m all for paying for art, for music, for performance. but to be completely honest, it seems really insensitive to not acknowledge in the current economy how many of your fans are in far worse debt, have much less $$$ and could never even come close to affording the travel and lifestyle you enjoy. and i know you work very hard for it, but recently it sometimes seems like you feel entitled to a nonstop flow of $$$ for your fans simply for being Amanda Fucking Palmer. for example, the last webcast i watched felt like it had little to nothing to do with art or connecting with the fans – it was all about collecting the $$$, selling stuff like those leftover photos that felt very much like an afterthought. so all i’m suggesting is that you try to keep in mind how many of us are also struggling to pay our own rent and realize that there are limitations to how much we can give financially on a regular basis.

Amen!

I always marvel at how you’ve been working the internet thing, and I’ve been trying to figure out how to make it work for me as a writer. (Publishing is just as murky a world as the music industry, I think) I believe artists should be paid directly, and should not be ashamed of doing it. I’ve purchased music and merch from you already. I plan on purchasing the DVD as soon as it’s back in stock. I’ve seen you in concert live. I’ve purchased the book. As long as you continue to share your creativity with the world, I will continue to buy some of it from you. I’ll spread the word so others will do the same.

That’s really the other part of the equation. Not only putting one’s own art out into the world and expecting compensation, but letting people know about other people’s art. Everyone who loves art, whatever form it takes, should be a patron. Should showcase, promote, show off artists they know and encourage others toward them. Should help create a world in which introducing others to art in this way is important. Oprah shouldn’t be the only one with an influential book club. Neil shouldn’t be the only cause of overburdened bandwidth on burgeoning artist websites. We should live our lives based on personal recommendations, not just on the art mass media tells us is important.

And by the way, people do bachelor/bachelorette auctions all the time! Hell, I’d let you auction off dates with ME if I thought you’d see any money and if I wouldn’t be embarrassed by the horribly low starting bids.

I’ve not heard a great deal of your music or attended any of your shows, but there’s nothing about this blog post that I don’t like. Self-publishing (@wilw) and web-publishing (@feliciaday); creative commons licenses (@doctorow, @brandonsandrson)… these things are becoming more common and business models are changing, and it’s important that we understand that. I’ve got nothing but respect for people who’ll stand up for their convictions like you have here, Amanda, and I hope this message gets out to as many people as possible so that they can get out and make art too.

In short… amen!

Yup, i’m fully behind you on this, money is such a touchy subject and apparently it’s vulgar to discuss it, hell we all need it, you’re earning it, you arnt forcing people to give you anything, we the fans are more than happy to contribute towards you and the amazing music/art you produce and provide us with.
you make us that little bit happier in our lives and that is commendable, if someone can making me smile when i’m feel blue that is a damn miracle and i for one think you’re worth every penny.
We are showing you our appreciation and if we can get out own little AFP memento out of doing so we are going to be happier than a bunny in a barrell of carrots, i would rather buy something from you and know you are getting the money than to find something on ebay and give my money to some grubby little greedy shit.
We all love you so we will all support you, <3.

Amen…And in fact, I’d encourage you to go ahead and put out a permanent cyber tip-jar on your site. Some of us would throw you some currency-love even without you having to stand like a statue for 9 hours straight or toss us signed swag. Granted, I always appreciate a little Amanda goodness in my mailbox, but I am more than willing to play the role of benefactor every once in awhile (a rare while, given the economics of the moment, but you get the idea).

Love the Tip-Jar!

I could not agree more. You must make a living to continue. I just bought tickets to the show at the Bijou theatre and in a few years when I am making the big bucks I will gladly spend more money on things like pregnancy test from Amanda’s videos.

The internet has made it such that just about anything is available for download, free of charge. For years I’ve been torn with the feeling that downloading is immoral. I take what I want, I enjoy what I take, and I give nothing back. Credit should be given where credit is due. Listening to your music, reading your words, gazing at your face, these are all things that I derive pleasure from and as such, should be justly rewarded. The guilt is easier to swallow when you feel that disconnect with the artist…. Middlemen such as the record company, the chain CD store, ticketmaster, etc enable that disconnect. You convince yourself that you’re screwing THEM over and what’s it matter when they’re already filthy rich? I think when an artist takes to their fans the way that you have, you make it personal… more intimate, more real. Yes, you deserve to be compensated for your art and no, there shouldn’t be any shame in sticking your hand out. It’s like any sector in business… You provide a product, you expect payment in return. The internet has been an invaluable resource for artists but it has also brought in a new era of thinking and the way that artists should be compensated for their art. I support where you’re going on this… As you said, paving the way for those behind you… Sure there will be mistakes made along the way but there is no guide book out there…. Feel it out, do what works for you and what puts the most money directly in YOUR pocket because it is your art, afterall. Cheers!

I love your music and hope you got a least a few pennies from the label for my CD purchases. Also love the webcasts (although timed for west coast after work hours or weekends would be great). I don’t have a lot of money and I definitely don’t need more stuff (even if it has AFP nom), but I enjoy and value your entertainment and would definitely put a tip in the jar when I have extra cash.
Make the tip jar permanent, keep on doing what you’re doing and thanks for the beautiful music.

I feel pretty bad that I’m a broke college student and can’t help you out. I’m glad that more artists are getting rid of the fucking middleman, though. I tried buying a $12 ticket to guarantee I’d have one to a show I wanted to see last year, and ended up having to pay $30 due to fucking Ticketmaster and Live Nation and their gratuity charges and all that fucking bullshit. Later it turned out I could’ve still bought a ticket at the door for just the $12, and I’d’ve known that it was actually getting to the band, so we the fans, and they your fellow artists need more people like you who will force a long overdue change.

A-fucking-men!

‘z’

P.S. Totally off-topic, but what’s your favorite Beatles song?

This is all so valid. I date a sequential artist. The major comic publishing companies, and now newer ones like Tokyopop, are taking advantage of young, unestablished artists all the time with iffy contracts and low pay.

And still, so many artists in the field are afraid to break out on their own and make their own way. There are still so many needless taboos about artists -actually- making money. It’s becoming easier with things like Deviantart and Etsy, but just hearing about this blog put a smile on my girlfriend’s face. You tend to have that effect in our household.

It’s a brave new world. Someone has to be the first to look at the map of the world we know and say, “Fuck this. This is not gonna take me anywhere productive or interesting,” and walk right of the edge. It seems to be you. Do I wish I was less broke and could personally enjoy more of the auctioning? Yes. Will I buy a ticket/CD/Poster/Book if there’s a show in my area? Hell, yes. Criticism? Nope. Not only do I deplore the way labels treat artists, I think they treat the audience like simpletons and I’m tired of it. I have friends who are releasing their new album on USB drives, I have friends who’ve done the indie label deal, I have friends who’ve given up because breaking into, “the business,” is too hard and soul-sucking. Anyone who can survive as a working artist in any medium deserves respect. That you’re making the audience part of the process in an active way, may take getting used to for some people. They will get used to it, though. Good on ya, (and Beth, Kayla, Sean, etc.)

Just wanted to say – this may sound strange, but – I have no idea who the hell you are. I’ve never heard of you. Living under a rock? Possibly. Frighteningly engaged in trying to support myself with only my original instrumental music? Totally. But I have one thing to say:
AMEN!
Fer sure. What I just read rocks, big time.
all the best,
the NAIL

AMEN. you’re so honest about why you do what you do. this makes you my hero.. you have no shame in telling the truth. thank you. fuck the critics that don’t see what you’re doing for artists. i love that you stand up for whats right and you don’t have your fans follow you blindly. i love you and what you’re doing for artists.

AMEN!

amen!

A-fucking-men

Not sure why people are hatin’. Seems pretty legit to me. I think it’s awesome the ideas you come up with to make money, and I think you’re fans equally love giving you the money when you make it so much more unique and personal.

amen! nicely said!

I think, like you said, the big problem is people don’t realize how they’re getting “raped” by the record company. Buying a god damn postcard that you wrote my name on and mailed to me went directly to YOU, the one that makes the amazing music and does other amazing shit which I love. I don’t want to “support” you through fucking iTunes or whatever because that’s not actually supporting you. That’s supporting people who I don’t give a shit about and don’t give a shit about you. If it means you can keep making your music, sending Twitpics, and buying makeup to draw your eyebrows with, then I am more than willing to give money to you. Thanks for being so incredible.

Amen!

I have NO problem with people making a profit.. I encourage it. I expect to pay for my entertainment because it has value for me… and the people who produce it have value for me, so I dont mind that they make money off of me.

Amen!

I’d agree that there’s a stigma to the pass the hat system, to a point. It’s not okay to put the hat out in front of you on the street, but it is okay to pass the hat in a theater watching a play. It’s all a matter of tricking your audience. If you ask them to pay, after giving them free admission to something they’re used to paying for, they are more likely to fork over a few bucks than if you’re on the street. Of course one requires a significant amount more start-up money than the other.

The internet is still a medium wherein, people don’t expect to pay for things. Much like people see street performers the same way they see trees, people see music on the internet the same way they see text on the internet. So what you’re beating at is a change in the way people view the individuals putting art online. I don’t think we’re there yet, as a whole, obviously you’ve got people who get it ™ but as long as some people are willing to do a ton of work for free, it’s gonna be hard for people like you who realize the obvious flaws of the system.

Keepin’ it real is always applauded. Good job!

I love you being crass about it.

Who are these people talking? Let them talk.

Just do exactly what you do, because that’s why we love you.

A-FUCKING-MEN. I don’t mind if you shamelessly ask me for money(nakedoptional…thoughpreferredXD) I will respond by shamelessly pulling out my wallet and gladly handing over every last dollar I have(Naked,ifyoupreferLOL)The way I see it? Every dollar I earn belongs to you. Why? Because you inspire me to move, to continue on with my life. I want to be a writer, I want it so bad it hurts. I never would’ve discovered that had it not been for you and your lyrics. So, DAMN STRAIGHT. I don’t mind giving you every dollar in my wallet. Because for every worthless, meaningless piece of paper I lose, I am payed back, with INTREST, by your wonderful music. And anyone who glares at me, and calls me stupid for it can suck my imaginary balls and piss off. They don’t understand. And no, I’m not kissing ass. XD It sounds like it, but I’m not! Really!;__; I love you, Amanda. …LOL~Xenjn

(Sorry if my english sucks…)

I honestly don’t see what’s the problem here, why would people critize what you’re doing. I’m a fan of yours, and I happily pay for your records, dvds and concerts… And I would also pay for a dress, of a prop from one of your videos, or whatever (you know, if I had the money :P). It makes me feel good that I know the money goes directly to you, because you’ve earned it!

You sell, we buy. I don’t see anyone complaining about any other type of seller selling things to make money! You are an artist, of course, but you are making a living out of it… And it makes the fans happy, it makes you earn money… What’s the fucking problem?

I don’t know what the hell it has to do with morals. I guess I just don’t get it XD

AAAAAAAAAmmmeeeeennnnn!!!

AMEN!!!

A: Proud, strong, keen, unflappable, original, shrewd, bright, warm, loving, creative. And, my hero.
Q: Who is Amanda Palmer?

Read Lewis Hyde’s book The Gift, if you haven’t already. It takes your argument to the Nth degree.

Yes, totally Amen. A lot is bandied about re: Street Performer Protocol when it comes to digital media, since the “product” is no longer held hostage until the money is paid: the performance, media, “content” is out there, and there is an implicit or explicit “ask” from the artist for compensation.

I have been to your concerts. You’re god damned right it’s worth it.

Very well said, A. As a finance/Econ guy I love the direct exchange of music/art/etc for $$$. I love how technology seems to have us heading towards eliminating the useless, zero value added middle man. The useless intermediary that not only siphons off the profits going to the artist, but often diluted the quality/message/meaning of the art coming back at us that. (Often distorted by them to produce a product which they feel is more commercially viable.) I think this direct connection is the best for the artist and us as well.
P.S. The finance part of me also says I’d keep specific dollar amounts on the DL. As this technology is evolving to artists, consumers, etc Uncle Sam is trying to figure out the evolution as well. They want to make sure they get theirs and keep everyone in line. I’m sure making an example of a high profile artists would help their cause. I’m sure we’d get some killer bluesy songs from you in the slammer, but Neil would miss you terribly!

Amanda, I totally agree! Thank you SO much for the webcasts, and I for one am glad to hear that you do well at them. I’m a grad student now and have negative money (aka massive debt), but after getting this damn degree I hope I can start giving back to awesome artists like you! (maybe in the not-so-far-off-future webcast) For now, I’m saving up in hopes of flying/hitchhiking/begging my way from Denver to the east coast to catch a few of your tour dates! You inspire me and bring me hope!

You know what? I definitely agree with you in the new model for approaching the fans, to be able to make a living out of art withouth having to sell your soul to a record label, and despite it’s true that not everyone can do this; you rule for being able to do so!

Amen a million times. I LOVE that I can interact directly with you, and buy things directly from you and that you come from a street performance background, and all that means. Don’t change -its what makes you vibrant and amazing.

a-fucking-men sister.

i first heard you in a dresden dolls vid on a tiny tv in a tiny restaurant in pisa, italy. (which was a weird, wierd happenstance cause i live in minnesota.) i promptly stole every track on the album, but when i had money i bought it. and all your other cds. and then i bought them for friends. and then i bought concert tickets. i made a point to support you because i wanted more, and i wish more people felt that way. we need you to keep experimenting, to break new ground and find new paths. i don’t agree with everything you say, and you piss me off sometimes. but i love what you’re trying to do, and i will continue to follow your career and support you. art dies without experimentation.

rock on. we love you.

Amen. There should be no shame in asking money for what you do. And there is no shame in paying for it. When the man with the flute in the train station makes the end of my long evening commute better, I give him a dollar. When I find something that soothes my soul or incites me, it’s worth my money. And it *doesn’t matter* how much money has already been paid, given, collected. ‘cos that isn’t my business.

Business is business, and business runs in the family, because it feeds the art. Thanks for writing this – it makes me feel better about the “selling out” aspect of selling art.

yes Amanda amen fuckin’ AMEN!!!!! Im so tired of people still being under the impression that music and art is not ‘work’…. I left my corporate ‘job’ a year ago to pursue music and art to make my living and actually live a life and not use up all my energy simply making money to survive but actually ‘live’ and I’ve worked harder at this than anything I’ve ever done! being an indie artist means we need to figure out new and creative ways to make a living… and I too am not ashamed to take money for giving something beautiful to someone who walks away with a tear or a smile because they were moved by my creativity! and I also as an indie musician artist watch you Amanda Palmer and watch what you do, how you do it and you inspire me to keep going, to keep being independent and real and honest about what I do… so thank you AND fucking AMEN!!! mucho love always! sabine (ArtemesiaBlack) xxx

Amen! A million times amen. You should never be ashamed to ask for money directly from the fans of your art, nor should you be ashamed to tell people how supportive your fans have been. I can understand where the heat about money is coming from. Money is a terrible thing. People who don’t have it feel left out of the world, and of course this is going to translate to their favorite artists. All of this is new, and you are trying to spread the word about what is being accomplished here in terms of the new system of fan to artist support. Critics are probably confusing your excitement and desire to share what you have learned with arrogance or pride.

You have never charged a “ticket fee” to your webcasts, and are sensitive to the cans and cannots of your fan base. You praise fans for supporting you in other ways besides direct funding (artwork, food, lodging) and the door is always open. You provide your fans with more entertainment and going ons off the bill than one can keep up with. Honestly, being a fan of yours is like a year around Christmas. I know this is a result of the efforts of many beautiful people, and it’s a sin that the conventional systems in place are not willing to support them as well. But the bottom line remains that i you have the means, and the art is improving your life, cough it up!

I think as long as you continue to make it clear that any level of support matters, even if you cannot afford to donate money, as long as it comes from the heart and really reflects what you are willing to sacrifice to the lifetime of devotion this individual has placed into the art that you are looking to touch your soul. It’s a drop or two of wax to keep that candle burning for the next person coming along who desperately needs some light.

Just thinking of the existence of someone like you in this world brings me joy. And from you, I have found so many other artists and beautiful minds that create this joy in me as well. This life is a root infested, rocky soil, which we must churn everyday without rest. But artists are flowers. If we take th time to water them, care for them, and let their roots take hold, life is a beautiful garden. If we cut a flower from a tree, stick it in a vase, well, it’ll look nice for a few days, I guess. But it wont be a part of your life. It wont touch you on the same level. And hell, if supporting a force that strong in this world is shameful, slap a fucking dunce cap on my head and sit me in the corner.

Hearts and Goats for you!

Afuckinmen. Seriously. If it helps keep the music coming, if it helps you to keep going, it’s what matters. People take it for granted, they think musicians who get a little notoriety are making big money, but it’s not necessarily true. And even if they are why shouldn’t we want to support them to the best of our abilities? If we were in their shoes wouldn’t we want them to know we care enough to keep supporting them?

Ask all you’d like. Your music is more meaningful than anyone’s has ever been to me. Every word holds meaning, you can tell you put your heart into it and you deserve every cent you get.

Keep doing what you do, Amanda! I am happy to give money in the name of art or a good cause, and I think that buying your record and book fall under BOTH categories.

Since I’ve started listening to music as a teenager and painfully trying to get together the money to buy a new CD/artwork, I have craved to give this precious money to the person who touched my heart (the musician, writer, sometimes the cover designer, too). And for how much I understand that the record business and manager system has its use and sense sometimes, I’ve always hated the idea that something that I could easily copy gratis from a friend or download from dark corners of the internet, but that I buy because I want to SUPPORT THE ARTIST will give the artist 50ct while 15$ will get lost on the way. I just LOVE to give you my money directly for all the fun, feelings, tears and joy you are giving me, and I am grateful that you find ways to come and ask it. This is the future.
And if you manage to get really rich that way: A lot of people are getting rich with very very dirty hands or by funny tricks on marketing and clever contracts. If I see one day my AFP on her own yacht with a cocktail in her hand, earned by giving your art and so much of yourself to the world, it will just feel right.

another A-FUCKING-MEN to that!!!!

Many many kudos, Ms. Palmer! I love seeing this from a musician’s perspective, because as an illustration student, I’ve come across the same issue. Often, people don’t seem to view art as something worth paying for– but they want it anyway. I don’t get the logic: you wouldn’t ask a plumber to fix your sink for free, right? I fail to understand how a career in rote paper-shuffling, say, is perceived as somehow more worthy of income than the career of someone who dedicates their entire life to a creative process that may or may not ever pay the bills. Nobody begrudges a office worker or bus driver or teacher their income, hopefully. So why shouldn’t artists, visual or performing or musical, be paid fairly for their work? Just because you’re actually pursuing something you love doesn’t mean you don’t deserve to make a living off it. Why is it okay for us to talk about how much money athletes and actors make, but not musicians?

I think more artists should be this up front about money– with times as they are and people pinching pennies, it’s important for people to know just what they’re supporting and how their dollar does make a difference. It encourages me to see you and Patrick Wolf becoming quite vocal about this– I do think it will pave the way for other artists in the future. We are all each other’s best patrons; after all, when you go to a show or buy a CD or a painting, it doesn’t only benefit you and the artist, it benefits everyone else who loves the artist’s work. Let’s keep each other afloat, yeah?

a-fucking-men sister

And I’ll admit it. My ass torrents music (I have a very skilled ass). The key is that the stuff I /keep/ I go buy, whether pressed in plastic or digitally though legit means. The stuff that I don’t like? I delete. I think that’s the rub. I’ve gone to a couple “free” shows to. If I stay, I make sure to pass along some nickels for the trouble. If I don’t dig it enough to cough up a few bucks? I leave. If I still stay, I at least buy a few drinks so the house will be willing to have the performer back again, cause hey, the house sold a buncha drinks.

This isn’t that hard of a concept, is it?

Amen you good woman! I work as a healer and get this sort of shit all the time. Oh you shouldn’t charge for this, reiki should be free, you can’t ask for money for that. well here’s the news flash, I work hard, I do a good job and I had to pay to learn this stuff. If you want free healing on someone’s sofa in the lounge room, go for it! If you want to come to my place of work and participate in what I do for a living then yes you will have to pay.
What you say about breaking ground for others is so true as well. You are a heroine! If we have gifts we should be able to use them and make a living from them, end of story.
phew I feel better now! BTW to all those healing should be free types, by tithing my own income (and holding out my grubby little hands for more), I raised enough money to build a small hospital for the nomads in the Kokonor region of Tibet.

big love
Karen

AMEN!! Love your straight forward and direct approach to this subject! As artists, we have to be our own advocates, and there should be no no shame in demanding what we are worth. The ‘starving artist’ archetype is a cliché – if we believe in ourselves and what we are doing, then we ought to believe it is of value in the way this society reflects value – $$!!

Oh and as for paying an artist directly I don’t understand how people can’t be for it. There is a huge benefit to the fans that perhaps is being over looked. Artists will actually have perform well!! Amanda is awesome, it’s more then just music with her but sometimes I’ve gone to see a band and walked away disapointed. People can say that smaller a smaller audience helps but I’ve been to plenty of festivals where bands have come out onto the main stage and still connected with the audience. It’s the band or artist not the size of the audience in my opinion. If that audience is paying the band then it follows that their “paycheck” will be relative to their performance. Yay for enjoying every gig I go to!

A-FUCKING-men. In no other line of work is it considered okay for people to debate the philosophical merits of you getting paid. Gah.

One thing that might help people wrap their heads around this is a breakdown of just how much it costs to be a working artist and get your stuff out there. (For instance, I remember reading that WKAP put you deep in the hole financially–which is fucking insane, especially for that masterwork–but others might not realize the severity of the situation.) I’m not saying that you have to justify yourself to these people in ANY way, but the creative lifestyle is so far out of the paradigm of many that a little clarification would allow them to get why fan-based support is more and more necessary these days.

Regardless, keep on doing what you do. (Oh, yeah, and come to Ohio sometime so I can put money in your tip jar in person!)

Amen.

AMEN!

And excuse me for missing something during the last auction, was Holly really offering THAT on the dates, no, I didn’t think so! Gotta love people and their hyperbole-for-effect!

Let me know when your next in Florida, would love to attempt to tip your hat to the positive!

^.^

PS – It’s been an absolute joy following your exploits on twitterYouTube/MySpace/blog.amandapalmer.net! I’m waiting patiently for the next installment, oh, I hear a bird tweeting, could it be?… ^.^

Well said. Indeed. There’s no free lunch.

I don’t know what the big deal is. You’re not forcing anyone to pay money. It’s everyone’s choice. All artists depend on their fans for income. Maybe people should learn to… ya know… calm down.

Gosh $740 for a date with Holly was a bargain!

The artist doesn’t say ‘Thank You’ in any meaningful way.
The money given to the artist is the fan saying ‘Thank You’ to the artist. The artist just has to require them to do so. Like a parent temporarily refusing to hand over an ice-cream to the child… “What do you say..?”

The irony is that your “leave a tip” link does not work for me in firefox. Perhaps the default popup blocker? I rather have you making new albums than standing very very still, that’s not very particle

Amen

Question though, how can anyone bitch about you holding a webcast??? It’s free to watch and only costs if you busy something… Complete tossers if you ask me…

Fucking Amen! I’ve passed this on to my Twitter followers who are photographers. Thanks for saying what needs to be said.

Jim (@jimgoldstein)

A-fucking-men! I’d much rather give my money to you – who created the art – than the money hungry corporations who bring no joy whatsoever into the world!!

Yes.

Finnaly someone that has thought about this!
Awesome post.

Go Amanda. Eff the haters.

I like the idea of directly giving you my money. I would directly give you my money if…well, I actually had any money (not poor student, or poor artist, just poor). I did buy a signed copy of your CD while you were performing at the Big Red Door in Edinburgh (I was the one telling my friend off for yelling at you that your crap while getting bad looks from everyone else for also hugging his arm), but I don’t know if that went to you or a record company and I also realised after I probably paid less for it there than I would have done had I wandered to HMV the day later and paid for it unsigned.

And, to be honest, you’re giving people something for their money and making them feel part of it. Laying down art in front of them and telling them they can take a piece home.

One thing I hate about other performers is when they’re performing they have to put on some 2D persona of themselves and you don’t do that, you’re yourself and beautifully unafraid of that. You actually stand there feeling like your getting to know someone.

This is just my opinion and we all know that opinions are like toilet paper. Still, I read this and wanted to respond.

There is nothing quite as awesome as being able to participate in the creation of something larger than ourselves, and I nearly always get that moment at a show. I buy CDs at shows, both because I prefer physical formats and because I know that artists get more from those sales than the ones in Walmart. (Or perhaps, artists get the same amount but I’m still paying slightly less and Walmart isn’t getting anything.) If I could give the $10, $15, $20 etc. that I pay now to see a show directly to those artists, I don’t mind doing that. Heck, I spend more than that now and they see far less because of ticketmaster. I bought a ticket to a show last week. I paid 60% of the ticket price to Ticketmaster in taxes and fees. I can’t be the only person who thinks that’s ridiculous. Good on you Amanda, and, if you ever manage to wander by my neck of the woods, I’d be happy to toss that money into your uke case.

Amen.

There seems to a weird perception about art, that somehow the world could do without it and that artists are just playing around. I don;t think people realise just how grim a world without art, music and literature would be. Artists deseve more that we can give them, so throwing someone a couple of bucks for making my world a brighter place doesn;t seem like such a stretch.

Fucking Amen!!

Do you make enough money per cd for it to make it worth fans buying them? I am all for giving money to artists, but I don’t really care about record labels.

If there was something wrong with what you were doing, it wouldn’t be working.

fucking amen!!!!

Thanks for much for being brave enough to tell the unknowing public about the state of the music industry and the art scene as a whole. If people were more informed on the most direct way to have their money hit an artist’s pocket, and that musicians with even some form of airplay are in no way rich, I think we’d see more people supporting the art that inspires them on a daily basis. But you’re right about not stopping when someone becomes financially successful. As long as they’re inspiring you, continue to support them.

Amanda, I cannot believe that people are begrudging you this. For me, your amazing webcasts are an opportunity to see you as you are, without the false front that record labels et al put on their artists. I get to see the woman I admire being herself and enjoying it. I only more artists thought to/were allowed to use the internet in such a giving way. You are giving us yourself and we are grateful for it. I feel connected with you, and that makes all the difference.

As for the auctions… People do not have to buy if they do not want to. If they *do* buy, like me, it is a chance for them/us to get hold of stuff that cannot be bought in shops etc… and know that we are directly supporting you in your quest to make great music.

Do not feel that you have to explain yourself, I think you have got the right idea. If only more people thought your way.

Thank you for taking the time to be amazing to your fans. I am grateful and will continue to support you in any way I can.

Much love…

-Brogen (Ireland)

Amen. A-fucking-men. People should be cheering out loud that you can do this, I LOVE that you get good results from passing hats or selling pretty 20 year olds (and people need to get over that too – it’s a DATE, not a wedding. Grow up people!) – I love knowing that unzipping my wallet and tipping it upside down into the collections helped you that little bit to do that beautiful thing you do.

I like that your friends are honest with you and tell you whats being said too.

“morality is by nature objective”
You sure on that one?
“can i get a fucking amen?”
No, of course not. If you really believe in what you’re doing you shouldn’t need one.

Does this imply that you plan to break ties with the aforementioned companies and do everything either on your own or with some sort of performer’s collective? Or will you continue to do business with said rapists AND ask fans for extra support?

Good Luck. I hope you make enough money today to consider the former.

Fantastic post! I’m a Mass Art grad who has been working at Sbux for 5 years. I want to get out but I can’t seem to. I would love to do what you’re doing, supporting yourself doing what you love, but it’s not easy at all. I’ve been really lucky though and have been doing commissions for my fans on Deviantart, a handful have commissioned me a couple of times and even pay the higher prices. It’s really a blessing to have them help me! I used to charge next to nothing for 8-12 hours of work spent on one piece of art, but finally got the courage to raise my prices.

Thank you again for posting it, people who don’t make art need to be aware of all of these details! And keep on keepin’ on!

p.s. I love the statue performers I see in Harvard sq.. There was a beautiful marionette girl the other day but I couldn’t afford to give her anything. Kudos for doing that for so long.

Here here.
Art through it various forms is being devalued by the disposable nature of today’s society.
It’s simple people, if you don’t pay for the good things all you will have left is crap. Stop complaining and support the artists that you love if you want them to continue to create. We’re going back to a patronage model that musicians used to exist under in the past. The difference it will be many smaller patrons contributing instead of one very wealthy one.

What people forget is that everyone who has a “real job” is putting their hat out there and asking ONE person, ONE department, ONE corporate entity, “please like me enough to give me money so I can eat.” An artist with a middleman/agent/company rep/whatever they’re called is in fact chained down; the rep/agent/person goes out there and thumps people on the head until they pay attention, and then asks them for money, supposedly on behalf of the artist, but the artist then only gets a percentage of that (’cause, to be fair, thumping people on the head is work, and they need to eat too). But if I as a fan am willing to pay $xyz for music, painting, performance, sculpture, whatever, why wouldn’t I want the entirety of that money to go to the artist, rather than some to the artist and some to the head-thumper guy?

A-fucking-men.

A-fucking-men!
I am a struggling performer (of the “worst” kind, as i am a dancer :O) and i’m learning now to pass the hat. LOVE your work!

Fuck, I was worried that reading this blog was going to make me feel EVEN more guilty about buying all your CDs so far off amazon, or would prove my friend right who was telling me today that she is “starting to see more faults in you”. But it didn’t, I am in fucking tears from the honesty of this post.

I don’t feel bad about the CDs anymore, i just know that I am going to buy direct whenever I have the opportuninty (oh and i’m sorry)

And I know that my friend was talking bullshit…the reason you are so awesome (for so many fans) is that you are a person, not some distant rock-goddess or a pin-up girl or just a name and an image. Sometimes people may see you as “shameless” or whatever but for god’s sake…since when does becoming successful artistically make anyone perfect!

For teenagers like me, who dream of being able to make a living through whatever art form, it is so important to know this stuff, and not to think that it’s easy.

I’ll shut up now before this turns into an essay but I’m so sorry for not supporting you and your art as much as I could and thank you, Amanda. You’re the biggest fucking inspiration I’ve ever known.
(oh my god, that was horribly gushy)

Great blog…and it should be followed up with a “Donate via Paypal” link.

Amanda, great post. You should post more pictures of your feet, and describe how ticklish they are. I would suck your toes and lick your feet anytime, and pay you for the honor to do so.

Amen! <3!

P.S: Some of the stuff you were saying made me have a revelation about something totally unrelated.
"BUT … i’d rather get the system right gradually and learn from the mistakes and break new ground…"
"i don’t care if we fuck up. i care THAT we’re doing it."
…Those quotes pretty much just changed my life and relationship with my boyfriend. Thank you, Miss AFP.

I like you Amanda Fucking Palmer – whoever you are!

Amanda – it’s nice to see somebody with the brass face to tell it like it is, and it’s no surprise whatever to see you being that body… you’ve got bigger balls than most of the men I know.

And that’s a compliment.

By the way – there are a lot of people over here in the United Kingdom who’d love to see you live over here… (hint)

fucking-a-fucking-men! It galls me as a fan that the way that I’m expected to show my appreciation is to buy some overpriced bit of plastic and hope that some infinitesimal fraction of my money will eventually filter down to the artist after first passing through the hands of scores of completely useless middlemen (and women, although most of them are indeed men.) I don’t like to see myself as a cow on a revenue farm based on exploiting an artist’s past work, I’d rather see myself as a patron who is funding the work that hasn’t been made yet. and I always put money in the hat of any street performer that I actually enjoy…

We all have the right to be paid for our time, talents, and work. I would rather pay an artist directly so they receive the maximum benefit for their effort. I admire your courage for standing up for what you believe in and your willingness to put yourself in the spotlight about this issue. You are breaking new ground, and there are always dissenters when change happens.

Both the music industry (and the publishing industry with which I’m more familiar) need more transparency about their practices. A few months ago, Lynn Viehl posted a royalty statement for her best seller and received both flak and kudos for it. http://www.genreality.net/the-reality-of-a-times-bestseller People, especially those who are considering joining the industry, need to understand how it works and what to expect. (Most people forget that artists, aside from eating and paying rent, pay taxes as well.)

Having said that, two of your closest friends and supporters brought up the same issue with you. You said in your post that you will make mistakes and you were right. You don’t have all the answers, and you will need to adjust your methods as you go. Maybe this is one of those times. Don’t dismiss the criticism and gossip as simple responses bred from fear (though some of them are). You might be able to use them for something positive, as a way to improve what you are doing.

P.S. It’s lovely that you told the people to lay off Beth for your actions/decisions. Your courage, bravery, and loyalty never cease to amaze me.

Shut the fuck up, get a real job.

Its people like you that have attempted to legitimize a now even more corrupt “industry” you’ve advanced no further then trolls on the BBS’s in the late 80s. Who ever showed you what a computer is need to be shot, burned at the stake and QUARTERED.

I hope you die in a fire and everyone forgets who you are.

http://www.punknews.org/article/35411#1375632

Hey Amanda, this is A. your biggest fan from Switzerland. I love you, you and your art, your music, your writing keep me going on and stay, try to stay, happy in this shit, mad, mean, rushed, dull, supersticious, demanding, sexist, rascist, homophobic world…THANK YOU for your hard work, for speaking up for love, respect, honesty and FUN!!!

it’s not YOU who invented the “no money = no chance to live”-system that we encounter (momentarily…) …so nobody has the right to blame you for asking for pay…

Amanda, you get a big “Amen” from me. Those who are pulling out their own “holier than thou” soapbox, climbing up on it, and spouting off about your “audacity” forget one very important thing: people CHOOSE to give you money, because you entertain them. You’re absolutely right — the middleman in this context, so the artists don’t get their hands “dirty”, is very much a thing of the past. You’re gutsy, you’re talented, and you’re entertaining, and those who complain the loudest, well…they likely aren’t any of those things.

I must say that I agree with you on this. I always admired your direct aproach, and as a future starving artist, I greatly appreciate you paving the way for the (mostly likely fully clothed in my case) artisits of the future. What you do makes you seem more real and more aproachable than any other artist I have ever admired, listened to, or seen. I don’t know where it was written that you had to send your money thorugh several other hands before it got to you, the artist, but it needs to be erased.

Amen.

What I really don’t get is why people care so much about how you get your money. You have to practice/play/write and learn songs all the time. You put more unpaid hours into your work than anyone else. I don’t sit at home going over how sandwiches are made, or the prices for different combination of food after you add in tax, I leave work in the work place, but your job is your life. It goes with you everywhere. Even if you aren’t practicing, or performing, or writing, if a fan saw you in the street you’d still greet them. You’d sign something for them, maybe chat a little.

As long as fans are willing to give, people should let them without a word. It’s not like your holding a gun to the piano and saying “give me money or the music gets it.”

In a way, you’re a friend, you need cash, and we loan it to you knowing that you may never give us the cash back, but you’ll return the favor somehow. You give us inspiring music, a tweet to smile about, a blog to read, and change our lives in so many ways. Why wouldn’t we want to spare you a few bucks? Or any artist for that matter.

So why not get a job that pays better? You don’t have to make a living the way you currently are. I work very hard too, but I don’t go around asking people to support me. If you’re passionate about your “art”, then you should be willing to sacrifice for it. The largest reward for artistic expression should be the art itself, not monetary compensation. To expect us to subsidize your artistic endeavors just seems crass and lazy to me.

Amen sister, amen.

Amen!

Artists should be paid for their work. Artists should be able to eat. Artists should not feel shame asking to be compensated for bringing joy, heartache and entertaiment to the world.

Amanda was a great statue in Harvard Sq.

i think paying straight to the artist makes more sense than having a middle-man.
i want to be just like amanda when i grow up.
:}

amen

Thanks for addressing the elephant in the room. I’m sick of feeling shitty for wanting just enough to get to the next town on tour and having to take their shitty excuses for why they can pay everyone but me. The only real money i’ve ever made as a musician is the money people have have handed me directly for my music. That’s the only honest way it’s really ever going to work well. You rule.

No more middle man= better for everyone.

Sanks.

Excellent blog, Miss Amanda Fucking Palmer! I fully support the starving artist (I wish to be one one day, for the simple pleasure of saying I was. What can I say? RENT glamourized it) and the not-so-starving artists who love what they do (the ones who have sold their souls and their sound to Satan don’t get my money, though). I’m currently a broke college student, but I managed to scrounge up the money for your last Seattle concert and it was worth every penny. You love your fans, and we love you. There are some artists I would never spend a dime on, but to you I feel no guilt at the thought of giving every penny I have. And I would if the college didn’t already have it.
Stay awesome, stay true.
Amanda Palmer, we love you.

Sorry–what I meant was DAMN RIGHT, exclamation point. Not question mark.

Art is worth to pay for ! Sabine

As a poor teenager, I rarely buy music or actually support the artist in some way (I /never/ downloaded songs illegally though, that just always feels wrong to me). I know that I should, but I just don’t really have the ability to do that at this point in my life.

I do plan (and things like this from you and LOTS of webcomic artists solidify this plan) to definitely give pretty good amounts of money either through product purchase or even direct donation once I do have the money. I am not a person who likes to buy things (giant tvs, useless trinkets, etc.), but I do like to appreciate work that has been done that I have enjoyed.

I understand and support the premise here, but one of the issues is that while we’re happy to support Amanda directly for the amazing artist she is, at the moment we’re still having to support the indirect, corporate side of it as well – by paying the bumped-up Ticketmaster prices to see her in the first place, and for the label-owned albums to hear her music… all that she doesn’t get a good return on. We have to think of our own finances as well as Amanda’s, and can’t afford to pay for things twice! Maybe when the label finally releases her, this system will be a whole lot fairer to all.

I love music, I love music videos, and I love your work. I don’t have a huge amount of cash, but I’m happy to send a little of what I have to worthy artists, I Need to hear more of your sounds and see more of your performances. I get paid next week, I’ll drop myself a link to remind myself to send you a few dollars, too much of my next paycheck is already spoken for *mourns for his recently deceased home pc*

I think most of the people who view artists that ask for money as evil, are just upper middle class kids who have had everything handed to them since day one while avoiding any hard work. Those who work and EARN their money know how valuable and hard it is to earn and don’t mind paying an artist for their WORK. Imagine that, paying someone for their work.

Amanda, I recommend you read this. It’s about the morality of money. http://www.quantumlounge.com/data/money.htm

Amen!

You know what? I would rather support your art–which brings me joy and solace and makes the world a more beautiful place–in a direct manner that I know you reap the benefits of than give my hard-earned cash to the machinery of the record industry. It’s simple, in my eyes–you create the art, you should get the money. I applaud your willingness to look out for yourself, because nobody else will, so bravo to you for being a realist and not backing away from the fact you do in fact need money to live. That’s what I find so incredible about communities like Etsy, where the money goes directly from the patron (aka customer) to the artist. It’s an incredible system, and I am damn glad to be able to participate in it.

in response to this:
mike (unregistered) wrote: I find it sick that people are dying in Africa and India and dont even have the opportunity to get a job at mcdonalds or cutting grass but yet you who are fully able to get a job at mcdonalds or any landscapping job gets on here and asks for donating money because you are an artist and need to eat to keep making music.. I am on a personal journey to stop any donations to you. Its sick kids, poor people with mental health problems in 3rd world countries dont even have the opportunity to eat once a day or work yet our money should be sent to you..
////

How about, instead of using your energy on stopping donations to Amanda, you maybe put all that energy into directly helping those people you are so concerned about?
You should really start a campaign to start feeding these people and giving them oppurtunities to grow. You need to rise up and shout from virtual rooftops how your heart is sooo big for these people you want nothing more than to see them fed and to live a hearty life.
If you care SO MUCH for third world countries you’d stop at this blog and use your energy to type up your thoughts you must have SO MUCH love to give to our third world friends. So…instead of espousing your drivel, go do something to directly help them to make up for the funds being lost to support a loved artist.

I’m sure this will not be read this late in the game, but honestly, I see a reoccurring sentiment here that I’ve experienced myself. Money is becoming the focus. Every avenue of the Amanda Palmer media assault these days is about making money, how much money has been made and how much money is needed. This is the illustrator of what went wrong with the industry and how it will go to hell in the hands of the artists. Money is like a drug, even when you get enough, you will keep spending so you need more. “Getting by” is never enough, so we get more and more extravagant with our desires.

I was a devoted reader of the blog for more years than I’m willing to admit. I’ve watched great ideas come and great ideas go. I’ve seen many ideas come crashing down due to irresponsibility. The first Dresden Dolls companion was overdue, can’t remember on the second one, but the WKAP pre-sale was a disaster and various other things. If more time was spent fulfilling obligation instead of coming up with more plans, people would be happier with this. When you’re waiting for something you’ve already paid for to be delivered late and in an inferior state that what you ordered, you tend to be upset when another scam is up to make money.

The ideas are GREAT, the follow through is weak. Anyone who disagrees with this statement is someone you need to add to the top of your buddy list because they’ll give everything. Think of it as a litmus test of sorts.

I think it is WONDERFUL that you are taking an initiative to battle against Roadrunner and correct the bad decisions Past Amanda made signing with them. It’s important to keep everyone on the up and up. However, the constant updates on how much money you made from each idea and then following it up with an apology on why the last idea isn’t working out is a bit ridiculous to the logical mind.

You have some of the most wonderful people in the world around you. People like Jason, Beth and other are folks that know what is good for you. They’re not afraid, they’re making sure you don’t go to the well so often that it prematurely dries up. Those who enjoy your music will continue to buy albums. I honestly disliked half of the WKAP album, but I will still buy your next release due to the track record of old.

Live simple for a while and build it up. Work on new material and ask people to help the album get made. Asking people to finance your rent, trips abroad and various other schemes is not appropriate, honestly. If you want people to pay the artist, then people need to get art in return.

yes yes yes yes yes yes yes.

the best irony in this situation is when you have bands who complain all the time about no one buying their records, and being in debt because of it, and then they go home and pirate an entire bands catalog. i live with some guys like this. we’re all musicians. and if you believe in free art, don’t complain when no ones volunteers to pay for it. but, if you accept the fact that art has value, and that by supporting artists you enable them to increase their artistic output, drop a dollar in the hat! karma has a funny way of returning the favor.

-jon
fatty acid
http://www.fattyacid.bandcamp.com

you are a complete inspiration. fucking love you, miss palmer!!

Amen, halleluia and all of that. In my business (knit design) we get a lot of “why should I PAY for a pattern when there are so many available for free?” — because unlike a lot of other people, I do this for a living, I pay tech editors and other assistants to put out the best possible product I can, and because it is the right thing to do if you like my work. It’s not rocket surgery, so good on you for this post!

Amen!! One of the best put explanations of the great street performance in cyberspace! I only performed 2 months as a busker but it was the best things I ever did. It also made me a believer in everything you’ve said here. So many ofthe same things that worked in street performance apply to virtual busking.

That includes not being afraid to put out the hat.

A-Fucking-Men!
Ignore the bullshit. Labels, ticketmaster et al haven’t added value in years. You’re at the fore, driving the necessary change in the industry. Like it or not – downloading is the future (whether for free or for a v nominal fee) and you gots to make money somehow. You’re fortunate enough to have a loyal fan base who also get it for the most part, which is how you’ve been able to pull it off. Hang in there!

the age of global patronage for artists is here; musicians are no longer tied to a single patron, but instead rely on a worldwide network of patrons for financial and material support. it worked in the past, no reason why it shouldn’t work now. the only things that have changed, really, are the technologies by which music is made and disseminated, and the means by which the artist is compensated. you still sing for your supper, when all’s said and done, and anyone who wishes to pay for your supper does. that you’re out there doing it and being HONEST about it just makes me respect you and your work more.

I have no qualms with supporting your music. I want to hear more of it, and would like to see you again live. I feel that most people who may be upset by this, did not feel inclined to buy anything during the auction webcast. Believe me, I did want to—it was just a bit (ha) out of what my finances allow. I feel that no one twists anyone’s arms to donate/buy anything. You have people supporting you in several ways, and it’s great that they can. I bought a couple shirts(I wanted them-no arm twisting), The book, posters, seen a couple shows, a play, and I am so glad that I have. I would be more inclined to spend a couple hundred on some merch, cds, and shows, than on one item. As cool as all of that stuff was, I felt it would just be something I’d own, have it sit in my house collecting dust with no real meaning.

Fans will support their favorite artists if they want to. I appreciate the forthrightness of how much money she’s making…Not like any of us actually need to know, but she’s showing how her fans directly support her. I suppose if she didn’t tell us how much money she is making off us, you would feel as if you’re getting shafted by not being entitled to that information. Don’t cry that you’re being being taken advantage of. If you want to be supportive, do so. And if you’re not being supportive, kindly shut your mouth because it’s not your money. As long as I know that my purchases are helping to bring another album or show my way, I’m cool. If I see that my(and others) support does not help promote more music/art goodness, then I guess it’s time to jump ship. I don’t mean that to sound like a big jerk. It’s a cycle. Art begets money(sometimes), and money begets more art(sad but true). When the latter no longer applies, I feel as if my part is not important anymore. I feel like this blog could have been addressed differently, but that’s just my opinion. It comes across as a little harsh. As someone who doesn’t show their support in large monetary ways, it makes me feel a little bad(maybe it’s not meant to). I just feel like anyone who is directly supporting through auctions/tshirts/shows/donations, should not act so offended. You were a willing participant. You can’t cry ‘rape’ when you supply the rose petals and handcuffs.

I also feel like sometimes the least supportive fans come across as the most needy. She doesn’t owe you anything. She’s an artist, it’s her job. She also happens to take time for her fans(awesome). Some seem quite insatiable. If she spent every waking moment with her fans, she would have no personal life, and no more music for us to listen to. I would never expect a musician to spend as much time on their fans as much as Amanda does. God forbid she make some money. She could just stop making music, and do something that pays much better and not have to be told she’s not kissing enough ass for her salary.

FUCKING AMEN!!!!

AMEN!! That 8 foot bride was pure genius and incredible courage. And you keep on giving! Thank you AFP! I will always buy your stuff direct from you. Promise.

Music is one of the few buisness’ where you work you ass off and if you don’t make the “big time”, you will die poor. Musicians have been there own worst enemy. On the local level you find bands ( mostly those who are supported by their parents), happy to play for free, cutting the throats of those who need to paid in order to sustain their art. I remember when you could scratch out a living simply performing 4-6 days a week. Venues would pay bands. None of this pass the hat or play for the door, or sell ticket shit. Chump change is going to cut it. Musicans are expolited and allowing themselves to be exploited. Local music scenes suffer, they become mediocre, the pros end up either going on the road, or teaching or altogether quit. Most bands don’t even make enough to pay for the own equipment. Being a musical artist was always rough, but today it’s ridiculously tough. There is some type of self defeting attitude with a lot of bands. It is bullshit to think you ought to give your art away. How would you be able to sustain it. Thanks to the pukes and blow hard club owners exploit and musicians who are willing to play for a few beers or pass a hat to end up with a measily $30-40 bucks, ruins it for other serious musical initiatives. Passing the tin cup might keep you alive, but is it a living? The record industry has also fucked us over for years with composers getting the least cut. I’m not sure what the answer is, but musicians, especially those who are serious, need to start showing some self respect. Does a lawyer or a doctor or a frigin Mayor work for free or by passing a hat for change? Why should those incrediably talented artist who enrich the lives of those who listen have to beg?

Amen indeed! Amanda, you are an inspiration to the rest of us starving musicians out there. I have been on the ‘get paid for your art’ campaign trail here in Edinburgh for 6 years now, but it doesn’t always make sense to the artists themselves, let alone the fans or venues! But, every little bit helps!

I’ve re-tweeted this blog, listed it on my own blog – http://www.hannahoreilly.com/?page_id=9
and also on my useful tips blog on my Collectives website – http://www.audreymusicgroup.com

Rock on, fabulous woman!
x Hannah O’Reilly
singer/songwriter/rock chick

Thanks for addressing this. I’m starting out and when it comes down to it, I’m going to have to ask people for money. The hat will be on the ground next to where I’m preforming. I don’t think there is anything wrong with what you are doing, you can’t do what you are doing without money. And some people are going to complain about it no matter what.

Art isn’t about making money. Yes, you need to make rent and buy food, but I think art seriously suffers when artists start thinking of themselves as celebrities.

Lead the way Amanda..

If you want to make money, you really may want to look into making sure YOU have the copyrights to your own stuff, not some record company. The Monty Python people did that and financailly it made all the difference.

check out this article on how they still make tons from royalties of their shows, 40 years later.
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601088&sid=aqe18z3MrBPU

Amanda I completely agree with you. Amen. I mean really when you think about it, this is the essence of democracy, eliminate the middleman and each person stands soley on the shoulders of his or her own achievements. I’ve never understood why the industry got so involved in the first place, although I have some ideas why, but nowadays they simply are not needed… so all the more reason the fans should be paying directly to the performer. Hell I wish my dollars went directly to my favorite performers.. it makes for better artists because their customer/benefactor is the public and not some media conglomerate who tell the performer what he or she will do..

That kind of old way of doing business only propagates the same crap over and over. It denies the public access to the true artist, and it denies the artist the ability to create a pure thing.

Anyways, just my two cents. I doubt you remember, but back in oh say 2003/04 I was at one of your concerts in Providence in which you were selling and autographing your CD’s.. I was so excited I left my credit card with you!!! I did manage to get it the next day from the bar, but I really appreciated that kind of interaction. I know the audience has gotten so much bigger, but your determination to involve the audience and create those intimate moments (ninja beach for example) really amaze me.. and THAT is why I would rather give my money direct.. it just makes for better people on both sides.

Looking forward to seeing you in Falls Church!

Gabriel

hey amanda!
it’s been a busy day and i just noticed you wrote a blog on such an interesting subject.
i’ve just made a print of this story so i can read it at home tonight in some peace and quiet.

i’m a live art performer myself and i’ve got a strong feeling you’re about to inspire me again.

i’ll let you know.

all the best from tilburg, nl

P.S.
I’m very interested in joining you concerning side acts, i read somewhere you were looking for live art performers ?? I can definitely add something great to that but I’d like to ask you.. do you think it is worth it for me replying to that subject when I’m living in Tilburg, Netherlands and I don’t have any money to book flight tickets ??? It sounds so out of reach but at the same time it sounds like the place to be…… I hope you can answer me. Thanks for taking so many great initiatives…. you keep killing my artistic insecurities with the only thing remaining; working hard and just fucking doing it out there and creating entertainment and giving it to demn people ! thanks. Levi

this post makes me inexplicably happy
amen to you miss palmer, a-fuckin-men

AMEN, sister. I couldn’t say it better myself. I totally agree 100%. Keep at it.

Peace,
Richard FUCKING Thomas
Neo-noir fiction
http://www.whatdoesnotkillme.wordpress.com

I agree with the sentiments of Amanda’s blog, BUT have to take issue with the undertow of making this an anti-record label thing. Artists have middle-people, and the bigger they get, the more they logistically need. Amanda, I’m sure, still has plenty of middle-people helping her – voluntary or otherwise. A record label simply is (or should be) a formation of capable middle-people. If a label rips off an artist, it’s no different to anyone else in that intermediary role ripping off an artist. Some bad apples doesn’t mean all apples are bad.

There’s criticism of Roadrunner, and them not promoting the WKAP album. I don’t know the details of her experiences with them, but promotion via marketing & advertising is BY FAR the greatest expense in the process of releasing records. Contracting (usually external) PR people and buying advertising space in magazines, etc usually costs many, many times more than the costs of recording the music, pressing the CD, etc. Irrespective of who makes the decision – whether it’s the artists themselves or a label – a call has to be made as to when that huge spend on promotion becomes a negative outlay – ie, you’re spending more on it than realistically you’ll see back as additional sales. Usually a label will (or should) shoulder a loss to promote a new artist into public awareness, and hope subsequent releases will need less promotional outlay once a fanbase is established. In Amanda’s case (and I repeat – *I don’t know*) maybe a heavy promotional spend wasn’t deemed efficient due to the existing strong fanbase? If it returned a loss, that’s then less money to Amanda to do what she does, and that’s what we’re talking about here, right?

The DIY thing has been going since the orig punk days, and getting fans & friends to help do things at grass-roots helps massively, and DEFINITELY the way forwards. But advertising & marketing is usually where you find you can’t call in favours or mates-rates, and you do have to start throwing rocketing amounts of cash around. When Amanda releases her first independent album, that’s going to hit her, and I hope she has experienced people who can do projections, accounting, offset Distribution fees, etc. I didn’t. I ran a label between 2001 and 2007 – the artists did the music and I did the cheque-writing, and we all slept in a van after gigs rather than put a hat around for hotels or whatever. Even so, I’m likely to still be paying off the (mortgaged) debts it ran up 20 years from now. I hope Amanda doesn’t “live beyond her means” artistically, as we did, and she can carry on making her wonderful music for decades to come.

Just thought it worth putting across the other side.

So, I love that Napoleon Bonaparte is this recognizable historical figure whose legacy mostly has to do with him being a megalomaniac who /thought/ he was some kind of pioneer.

Amanda Palmer: You fucking rock! I’ve experienced incredible backlash about my classic punk rock photos. Been told I’m so rich and famous, that I shouldn’t charge so much (while galleries insisted for years they could not show me cos my prices were far too low), received tons of fan letters, some horrible online backlash and yet, never made a fucking cent.

It’s gotten to the point I’m selling off what I can and doing something else. Whatever I do with my photos and stories, I will do for me. But right now, I rather eat raw food, walk, yoga, read and another business. Thanks for all the lip service, thanks to all of you gushing how much my photos have meant to you but you couldn’t fucking lift a finger to help keep my archive alive and in circulation. Fuck you to most of my “fans” who do nothing but give me lip service, use MY photos for your Myspace ID, bootlegs, whatev and think it’s fine that I live in dire poverty for my photos.

OR because so many steal my pix or just as bad, NEVER credit photographers (that is addressed to MAJOR book and mag publishers, who think a photo credit “ruins” the layout, when OUR photos are THE highlight of their publication, take forever to pay or don’t pay at all, thanks to all of you, I don’t have the time and money to share more photos and stories. Whether fans or so-called print of film professionals are self-destructive. Oh the stories, oh the photos, what peeps are missing cos they are so selfish, greedy, and lazy.

I’m blessed a few peeps have helped me, but it’s fucking embarrassing to beg for money when I’m the most published LA punk rock photographer, 1976-80. Or peeps who have used MY photos for free who argue with me that I’m stuck up.

PRAISE YOU AMANDA PALMER. Oh yeah, I love Dresden Dolls, have your CDs, and saw you at Music Box in LA. You rock and don’t back down. Artists deserve far more money than they get, esp when OTHERS make more money from OUR art than we do. Wow, do I know that well!

Am I bitter? No! I photographed some of the MOST awesome rock shows of all time, had a blast, lived a wild, wild life, with more memories than I’ll ever have time to share, plus the greatest time of my life. I don’t owe nothin’ to no one. I wanted to created an archive to keep those memories alive and to share with others. What I didn’t count on were all the fan emails with blind eyes to my archive and life.

Hooray for art and artists like yourself. WE deserve every fucking penny we can get! I too want a coin-operated boy. Thanks for the memories! Jenny Lens, “the girl with the camera eye” (annointed by Patti Smith, but don’t get me started on her, oh wow, talk about lip service!)

I appreciate the sentiment, but here’s the problem I have with this argument: AFP is still charging for shows, and still charging for her music. Why not go the Radiohead route and let the fans decide how much to pay for the album, even if it’s nothing? Not charging people for shows and music is the ONLY way to screw over roadrunner – but I’m not sure what is in AFP’s contract or if she HAS to charge for that stuff. But, she says right in this blog, concerning the critiques – “and even if they attend the party with rolling eyes, they will not be charged.” But, last time I checked the ticket prices, EVERYONE IS BEING CHARGED.
I’m not going to get back on AFP’s side until she puts her money where her mouth is and gives the music and shows away for free. Until then, this just comes off as greedy and arrogant. As a musician myself, I would never charge anyone to download my music.

it’s a really fun. but i like music and its a great article.It seems that it is not a SEO problem but that’s something wrong with the products you promote. They might be of good quality and fairly priced as you say. But if the products are not in high demand and/or the sales pages are crappy, you won’t make good sales, no matter what SEO work you do.

The only other explanation could be that you might not use BUYER keywords and attract too many freebie seekers/non buyers to your website.

For how long do you have those 250 clicks you mentioned?

i think there are more good tips!

A-fucking-MEN!!

Nobody in life gets exactly what they thought they were going to get. But if you work really hard and you’re kind, amazing things will happen.